VC Differences

I was playin VC at my friends house and I think I know why the text is so fast but I'm not positive.

The game doesn't seem to wait for space characters but instead jump immediately to the next non-space. When the giant was talking "call us" or whatever it slowly puts the text, but it was like this

c....a....l....lu....s

so not only did it not wait for the space but it also ignored the timing delay for the next letter

Also, the torch flames are small and funny looking. And yea the explosives are extremely non-laggy, so it is super fast for hovering.

Some cutscenes have less lag like Goht dying, which is funny because the cutscene looks like they were compensating for lag, so now he just rams into the wall and its abrupt and weird.

The thing is, not all of the text is faster. I know the cut scenes after beating a temple are pretty much the exact same on both versions. VC gains most of the time from faster loading and no lag.

something i noticed on VC is that the stray fairy in clock town is the wrong color.

I vaguely remember the L and R buttons pressing down differently in the VC version of OoT than in the GCN version(In one version you couldn't "fan" the L and R buttons, they had to be pressed all the way down).... Or was I just imagining things  :-X ?

Not sure if it's the same for MM.

aleckermit wrote

I vaguely remember the L and R buttons pressing down differently in the VC version of OoT than in the GCN version(In one version you couldn't "fan" the L and R buttons, they had to be pressed all the way down).... Or was I just imagining things  :-X ?

Not sure if it's the same for MM.

Yes it's the same thing in MM. What I've been telling people is, if you can open the GC controller(you need some special screw) then removing the L and R springs would make it a lot more tolerable.

Jiano wrote

Yes it's the same thing in MM. What I've been telling people is, if you can open the GC controller(you need some special screw) then removing the L and R springs would make it a lot more tolerable.

Yeah I've refurnished GCN controllers, you need a tri-wing screwdriver(I have every gaming tool on the planet). I think the buttons would be quite loose without their springs though...

PS: The white JPN import GCN controller actually has a different spring system than the original ones, less parts. Just thought I'd share that lol.

I think the fairy's a slightly/largely different colours.

The L and R buttons are not loose without the springs, they just stay down and it's just an easy click instead of having to push down kind of hard on them.

I know this from experience

meh idc bout the differences that much

other difference i noticed is if you roll into a bomb a certain way you dissappear for about a second then reappear. You can tell its recoil cuz you'll be farther back.

Lexkeeta wrote

other difference i noticed is if you roll into a bomb a certain way you dissappear for about a second then reappear. You can tell its recoil cuz you'll be farther back.

This is what happens on Mupen if you are holding Z for and do a HESS. Maybe it doesn't crash on VC?

i wasnt HESSin tho, just normal backwalk SS

i never tried doing the HESS crash... cuz I thought it would crash. I'll check before the end of the day

btw, seems the VC version is the original US N64 version since several glitches that were fixed on the GC version work on it (the use items on Epona glitches mostly)

looks like it is limited only to gliches to mess around so far..

Jiano wrote

This is what happens on Mupen if you are holding Z for and do a HESS. Maybe it doesn't crash on VC?

I've done plenty of HESS' and hasn't crashed. It can crash it VC, it depends how you do it.

Sorry to resurrect this topic, but this is kind of important.

Jiano recently apparently timed all the VC differences in this game and came out with the VC version being only a minute faster than the N64 version. Being the skeptic that I am, I decided to verify this figure for myself using Sony Vegas. As it turns out:

-Loading times on VC are, on average, about .3 seconds faster than on N64. Since there are about 120 loading zones in the game (depending on the route used for any%), VC saves about 36 seconds from loading zones alone.
-As darkeye measured, cutscene lag saves about 26 seconds on VC, totaling 1:02 combined with loading zones.
-Explosion lag usually wastes around 1/6 of a second per explosion (I timed this myself in vegas with multiple explosions throughout the game). This can vary a lot though (some areas have no explosion lag at all) so I think .1 seconds per explosion is a safer estimate. Assuming 120 explosives are used in the whole game (which is the maximum that would be used with 3 bomb shop trips), explosion lag would only save 12 seconds compared to VC. Someone else should probably check this since there's so much room for error with this though.
-The rest of the lag in the game probably doesn't even add up to 5 seconds, especially since VC lags in a lot of areas that N64 doesn't lag in. For comparison, deku palace and pinnacle rock (both of which lag pretty bad on N64 in a lot of spots) can both be done in about the same amount of time (with less than one second difference) on both versions.

In conclusion, VC could save anywhere between 1:10 and 1:25 over N64 in any% SS. In RTA, where resets would be used, it'd probably save less than 1 minute. It'd be nice if someone else who is knowledgeable about this kind of thing (cough cough darkeye cough cough) could check some of my calculations/work here in case I made a mistake somewhere.

one small diferance i discovered is that vc hess's are faster. i timed this about 10 times and i got the same results. do you think this will ever make a diferance? i dont think it will but just sayin.

VC? HESS? inb4 shitstorm

VC HESS is not faster; it's just that the explosion causes less lag than on N64, making the HESS start a few frames faster.

also lol hess on vc

cool

I already posted this in the Q&A thread, but I figured it was worth posting here too:

I went through timing the VC differences again and found some stuff I missed last time. Here are the new timings:
-37 seconds from loading times (0.3 seconds per loading zone on average with 125 loading zones in the current any% route)
-23 seconds from cutscene lag (darkeye timed this a while back)
-About 10 seconds from faster text in first cycle (this is nowhere near exact since slight differences in mashing speed could make up to 1-2 seconds difference here)
-11 seconds from faster unpauses (N64 unpauses are always exactly 19 input frames longer than VC ones). This is assuming you use a lot more pauses than N64 for lullaby skip ISG or don't buffer it on either (VC would generally want to advance 1 frame at a time since the unpause is so fast that the game's video output can't keep up with it)
-Around 12 seconds from explosion lag (this is a horrible estimate; explosion lag is extremely variable and the number of explosives used can vary. I assumed about 1/10 second explosion lag based on timing a few and taking the average and assumed 120 explosives used which is the max you would ever use in the current route. Obviously 12 seconds is probably a huge overestimation.)
-The rest of the lag is negligable, since faster playing can easily cancel out the tiny bit of lag there is (deku palace can be done just as fast on N64 as on VC despite all the lag there for example), and VC actually lags MORE in some areas such as Zora Cape.

This means that VC probably saves something like 1:30 in the any% single segment and segmented run. Obviously for RTA it'd be more like 1:06 since faster resets would save about 24 seconds, but since no one does RTA that's kind of a moot point. Most of this can be easily factored out (loading zones, cutscene lag, unpause lag), but the faster text, explosion lag, and normal area lag are a lot harder to measure. Thankfully this should never become an issue unless someone beats the current run by around 1:30 on VC, which is very unlikely since improvements in this game tend to be at least 4-5 minutes.