Wind Waker HD: What's changed, what hasn't

Roughly less than 12 hours until TWW is available to some gamers that are not called reviewers.

Earlier this year, I made a 38 minute video showing a series of clips you can do (or see) on the N64 and what they did to change it on the 3DS.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_twuOTykzu0

Now one day, I want to do a similar thing for this game. The polygon count is pretty identical to the Gamecube version so I'm not going to show much on the graphic changes unless there is a major overhaul, both the Rainbow Bridge and Ingo's Room on OoT are good examples of major overhauls.

The video is going to be focused between Console versions and not J vs U stuff (Grandma's Chest), however if anyone has access to both Wii U & GC in Japanese, it would be interesting to see if JP Wii U version uses either the US version (200 rupees) or not (Heart Piece)

This means I will cover stuff including:

- Tingle's Item
- Initial Max rupee count
- Number of Triforce Charts required
- Salvage Labyrinth (at the very end).
- Grapple Hook swing time
- Wind Waker encore.
- Salvage Arm speed
- Loading times, probably show a Superswim(?) trick that is not possible on Wii U due to faster loading times????
- BGM like Forsaken Fortress, Opening up a chest
- PictoBox - Number of shots on memory (3 GC vs 12 Wii U) and see if regular quest on Wii U gives you the black & white box.
- First Person Aiming
- Changing items, unsure on Wii U Pro controller atm (It's possible to upload direct feed screenshots from the Gamepad by going to Miiverse with a Nintendo ID account)
- Tingle's brother Knuckle....
- Swift Sail (more of an addition rather than a change)
- Tingle's hidden statue inside dungeons (Originally a bonus item for Tingle Tuner users)
- Joy Pendent awards (Hero's Charm on GC, Heart Piece on Wii U?)
- Glitches that got fixed.
- Famous shortcuts that got fixed like invisible barrier or higher walls.

Because some of you players are going to experience this game before me like 2 weeks at the most, I would like you to make some notes on what else has been changed during your playthrough and I'll add them to this post, sometime before/after I've completed TWW HD.

I'll be pretty shocked if there are actual regional differences that change things in the game this time around

Greenalink wrote

- PictoBox - Number of shots on memory (3 GC vs 12 Wii U) and see if regular quest on Wii U gives you the black & white box.

I would say it does:

Quote

Obtaining the deluxe Picto Box no longer requires a firefly from the Forest Haven; you only need to complete Lenzo’s three-part photo-taking sidequest to obtain a new Picto Box that creates color pictures.

From a different thread

One of Zelda Universe's editors apparently has a full copy of Windwaker HD, and they've mentioned a few things about it.

• The boat cannon shows the trajectory of the Bomb like in Skyward Sword.
• The Windwaker's beat does not start until you play the first note.
• After learning a song for the first time, if you play a song with the Windwaker it will not repeat, meaning wind changing will be faster.
• The Hero's Charm has been moved to be the reward for completing the Savage Labyrinth, while the Heart Piece that was there has apparently moved to Paw Island

Also some stuff observed from Cosmo's stream

• Rope/Grapple swinging mechanics have been tweaked to allow you to change direction while swinging
• Storage definitely does not work via the current Wind Waker dive meth
• It appears possible to double hit some monsters with the sword?
• Many actions have been moved to the A button, such as pulling blocks and stabbing with held weapons.
• Because you press A to swing weapons, you cannot jump while holding one.
• Since pull is mapped to A when standing next to a block, you can now climb up blocks by walking into them?
• When getting Game Over, the letters that drop down no longer have a sound effect to them
• Animeowzer's "Back in Time" glitch where you skip the gossip stone dialog cannot be performed as the ledge you grab onto has been modified?
• You do not have to hold down the button for items like the Boomerang and Grapple

I'm pretty sure the double hit comes from the thrust attack, the one where you press forward while L targetting. When I'm playing, it seems to have two hitboxes, and I've gotten the double hit a few times with it now (although I've also only used it a few times)

You can not get storage through a WindWaker dive by any means. Forest water storage WOULD work if the text box still appeared.

Merged threads to try and keep info in one spot for now.

Did the Swordless Link glitch and the Pirate Ship and FF1 turned black lol
Go to 1:09 to see it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nA2mkaYcRYg

PATCHED

Wind Waker diving - you instantly come out of the wind waker mode when you go airborne
Dry Storage - Wind Waker diving is gone so you cannot do this. You can't do it even if you are super low to the ground and use the auto-cancel.
Forest Water Storage - no textbox appears on the screen
Soup Glitch - doesn't work with the pause menu. didn't try with the instant swap but I doubt it works
Sail Pumping - this either doesn’t save any time or just frames. slow slow slow.
Grapple the bell from below - doesn’t reach or something.
Leaf past Helmaroc - invisible force blocks you
Enter Helmaroc loading zone via zombie hover - die when you enter? needs investigation
Helmaroc King last phase skip - Helmaroc never attacked me near the wall, this might be patched.
Wind God’s Aria without Iron Boots - you get full force of wind immediately after cancelling the wind waker
C-up with the mirror shield - doesn’t work
Mirror shield through the floor in ET - this only worked with C-up, so its impossible now.
Invisible Makar glitch - he’s not there!
Crash game by standing on top of ghost ship chest - fixed!!
Climb the Bell ToG - cant stop while ringing

UNPATCHED

Manual Super Swim - probably never viable nonTAS but interesting...
Ledge clipping - works pretty much like TWW. I got password skip, ToG clip, even Hyrule electric field skip (but there does seem to be a rounding difference in how the game handles grabbing a ledge exactly in the center of a bomb)
Zombie hovering - works the same way as TWW so far, except you cannot pause during it. Even the home menu has a delay to resume control. No tingle tuner means no healing.
Hyoi Pear skip / grapple clip - works at birds peak rock to get early Triforce chart and skip the bait bag and hyoi pair.
Gossip Stone skip - works from the left side, you end up swordless, FF1 lighting is dark and weird. orca doesnt crash.
"Cosmohop", Bulb Skip, etc - this and all other minor techs work.
Menu buffering w/ L or control stick - works with pro controller.
Leaf pumping - works the same
Short Hover - works in normal mode (not hero mode)
Roll through wind to get iron boots fast - works
Miniboss skip in Earth Temple - still plays both music tracks at once
Earth Temple Boss Key Skip (OoB medli flight) - works, harder because no shadow below link for the shorthop alignment
Early Pot in Wind Temple - same as before, hit it with a fire arrow.
Wind Temple Miniboss without smallkey - normal ledgeclip.
Wind Temple damage boost - works
Wind Temple Aria skip using Sidling - works
Pick up Wizrobes out of the air - :)
L-slide clip with hookshot - works in diamond steppe and elsewhere.
Hammer through walls - useful in Cabana
Trial’s Skip - just a ledgeclip.
Double rope grab - gains extra momentum (2swing in niko 2)
Morth Glitch - a little different as you remain heavy throughout the glitch. Wii U has more memory too I guess.
Flight Control Platform Glitch - when you go out it drains your magic?? anyway it spawned the ship at windfall as expected.

NEW

double hits with sword - sometimes, maybe due to less damage invulnerability on enemies? unsure.
gyro aiming - really fast aiming, pretty accurate too. Like OoT3D. One of the few motion controls I approve of.
fastsail - changes wind for you, slows down near islands (maybe try boat jump right before it slows to maintain speed
grapple change angle while swinging - hold left or right to swing while changing your facing direction.
dont get knocked out of boat by stuff - dunno the specifics
dont get knocked down by orca if you mess up 1 time - this is nice.
pots etc that used to spawn 3 hearts / 3 magic / 3 fairies etc, now only spawn 2.
bomb targetting reticle - in the water when using bombs yiu can see where they will hit in advance
short grapple cutscenes - both ocean and on land.

UNKNOWN

molgera air snipes - ??

Cosmo wrote

Flight Control Platform Glitch - when you go out it drains your magic?? anyway it spawned the ship at windfall as expected.

I'm pretty sure it drains your magic in regular TWW too

It does.

Too lazy to read the full topic, but Hyoi Pear diving still works. It's possible to use it to enter Forest Haven in the same spot as the WW dive. Diving can also be done using bait and spoils. Tingle Bottle, bottles, telescope, pictobox, wind waker, all instantly cancel. I tried doing a WW dive off a ledge that would be 3 frames above the ground, it gets automatically canceled when Link is on the ground, no storage.

Cosmo wrote

Gossip Stone skip - works from the left side, you end up swordless, FF1 lighting is dark and weird. orca doesnt crash.

As shown in the video posted, it works on both sides. Left is probably faster though.


As for zombie hovering into a loading zone, they may have just disabled loading zones if you have 0 health. This is probably easy to test without actually zombie hovering by just getting knocked into a loading zone with 0 health or something.


Did anybody ever figure out if there are hints anywhere for the Tingle Statues? Like maybe the NPCs on Tingle Island tell you or something? I imagine there must be....

Does anyone know if the three triforce charts point to the same place every time, or if they pull randomly from the original eight?

For reference, I got Greatfish, Cliff Plateau, and Stonewatcher.

Whatsoup wrote

Does anyone know if the three triforce charts point to the same place every time, or if they pull randomly from the original eight?

For reference, I got Greatfish, Cliff Plateau, and Stonewatcher.

Don't Think so, i got the same three

Hyoi Pear dive into FF2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_wZJYbxy8c
Hyoi Pear dive into FH: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQQiZuRpYXQ
Not sure if it's worth the rupees and time though.
Soup dive onto land may cause storage, would need an insanely high dive though.

Abahbob wrote

Soup dive onto land may cause storage, would need an insanely high dive though.

I thought the reason dry storage even caused a storage effect in the first place was because you press B to cancel twice (once to bring you out of cutscene mode, and one to put you in a "negative" cutscene mode). I don't see how it would work with soup, but let's hope you're right (doesn't really sound useful though).

Soup gives storage on GC, may on Wii U.

Abahbob wrote

Soup gives storage on GC, may on Wii U.

Oh wow, I never knew that, is there a video of it anywhere?



Also, has anybody tested this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag6YusISIzk
Cosmo mentioned you can't stop moving while swinging on the bell, but according to this video, you don't need to climb the bell to get oob. You just need a good angle I guess.

nathanisbored wrote

Oh wow, I never knew that, is there a video of it anywhere?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8-6PFQPXek

Found this spot today, the reason it works here is because sloped walls slow down your fall a lot as you can see. Somebody find a better spot to do this and we'll hopefully be able to test if this will still get us storage in HD.

I'll definitely look into this. Finding a good spot is going to be tough without tuner though.

Also, pendant dive into FF2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muG9sw7LLa4

Abahbob does that work at forest haven?

Cosmo wrote

Abahbob does that work at forest haven?

He tried it from where the second Boko Baba is at but I believe the fall was too long.

Paraxade and Abahbob both tested soup storage in the Forest Haven spot (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-zwTRps9Aw), and though it seemed like there were occasions when they hit the ground as the cutscene ended, it seemed storage did not activate.

Of course, they may have got extremely unlucky and hit the ground a frame too early every time, though the chance of that remains very low at this point.

Cosmo wrote

Abahbob does that work at forest haven?

No, I couldn't find anything to bounce off of. The slope that forms a corner is a slippery slope, so you don't fall off of it. A more precise dive may work, it would need to bounce off of some slope. I couldn't find a good one.

Is grappling the bell in Tower of the Gods (ToG) from an angle and leafing out of the bell area possible in WWHD as it is in WWSD?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag6YusISIzk

Does re-entering ToG after leafing out still softlock the game in WWHD?

Leaving the Flight Control Platform Game results in Link venturing in a slightly modified overworld (note pirate ship at Windfall Island).  Does leafing out of ToG and superswimming to other locations in WWSD also place Link in a modified world, possibly with some objects blocking temple entrances unloaded?

Can Link still target the Hyrule barrier in WWHD with the boomerang after engaging the knockback cancel as he could in WWSD?

After seeing zombie hovers not activate loading zones at 5:15:50 (Hyrule) and 6:22:30 (Helmaroc) of http://www.twitch.tv/cosmowright/b/463600934, there may be a change to the way the game handles loading zones as opposed to patches to specific loading zones.  What happens when Link tries to zombie hover into a loading zone that is directly in front of him in WWHD?  Does it activate?

Since preliminary testing shows soup storage doesn't seem to work in WWHD (which most players including speedrunners don't know about), it may be that the developers fundamentally changed the +1, 0, -1 system of cutscene "states" in WWHD, rather than just patch specific types of storage.

In WWSD, there were a number of sequence breaks that were found to be not of value since the progression of the game lead to a softlock.  Were there any sequence breaks that did not include storage that could be tested in WWHD?  I have yet to see a single softlock of WWHD.  Perhaps it handles them differently.

Was watching SuperMCGamer. Magic Armor no longer drains Magic. Instead it can be used indefinitely (or as long as you have rupees?). Taking hits drains rupees kind of like in Twilight Princess. Someone in the chat mentioned that the drain rate is 80 rupees per full heart lost.

NowaVar wrote

Is grappling the bell in Tower of the Gods (ToG) from an angle and leafing out of the bell area possible in WWHD as it is in WWSD?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag6YusISIzk
Does re-entering ToG after leafing out still softlock the game in WWHD?

Leaving the Flight Control Platform Game results in Link venturing in a slightly modified overworld (note pirate ship at Windfall Island).  Does leafing out of ToG and superswimming to other locations in WWSD also place Link in a modified world, possibly with some objects blocking temple entrances unloaded?

Getting OoB in ToG doesn't actually take you outside ToG. It's a separate map. That's why the loading zone doesn't lead anywhere, and why they put the triangle island closer (so you can see it from the tower I guess). Superswimming from there wouldn't lead anywhere, because the ocean would just go on forever and follow underneath Link.

NowaVar wrote

it may be that the developers fundamentally changed the +1, 0, -1 system of cutscene "states" in WWHD, rather than just patch specific types of storage.

Wind Waker never used a +1, 0, -1 system, that was just something made up by speedrunners in order to explain storage. Getting storage actually places you in a state where the game thinks a cutscene is currently playing while not actually being in a cutscene state. Therefore, the next cutscene that you enter will be immediately cancelled and will loop forever because the game can't play a cutscene while it thinks another one is playing because it doesn't want multiple cutscenes to play at the same time.

Just found this out and didn't see it listed anywhere on here.

GamePad only

When you play Wind's Requiem it was previously thought that you had to cycle one by one to get to your desired direction.
But you can touch the compass on the GamePad to select the direction you want right away.

Might only be useful in a handful of places though if the Swift Sail is used.