Low% Discussion

[RESERVED FOR LOW% INFORMATION]

So people will stop being like "lolani whuts the route bro" and making me type it out :U

TRIFORCE ROUTE:
Warp to GFI
Set wind SW
Sail S 1 block, shoot down ship, enter building and get chart 1
Sail W 1 block, shoot down gold ship, fish out Chart 2
Sail S 1 block, Hookshot up, do maze shenanigans for ghost chart
Warp to Outset
Savage labyrinth for Chart 3
(If using Tingle Tuner strats and have Song of Passing already, use Tingle pot until 3184+ rupees)
Warp to Windfall
Ms. Mary and Killer Bees shenanigans for Cabana deed
(Optional: get Song of Passing while at windfall for gud Ghost Ship stuff)
Warp to ToG
Sail S 1 block, Enter Cabana, do Sewers for Chart 4
(Play song of passing, open up ghost chart, warp/sail to Ghost ship for chart 5)
(If no Song of Passing, apply it during Night inbetween whatever charts you want)
Warp to DRI
Set wind N
Sail NE, hookshot up, enter hole, give em the business, Chart 6
Warp to FH
Sail NE to Bird Rock
Nifty-ass grapple hook shenaynayguns, chart 7
Warp to SFI
Sail NW, pick up head, More business giving, chart 8
(If not using pro TT and SoP strats, do 101 rupee trick off the pillar in here until 3184+ rupees)

Warp to Tingle Island
Translate Charts, open charts
Warp to Windfall
Sail 1 N, Piece 1
Warp to DRI
Sail 1 N, Piece 2
Warp to FH
Sail E-NE, Piece 3
Warp to GFI, Piece 4
Set wind SE
Sail SE, Piece 5
Sail 1 E, Piece 6
Warp to Outset, Piece 7
Warp to SFI
Sail 1 S, Piece 8

With Cabana early, we can now get bottle instead of a heart piece (and delivery bag? or do you have to hit the loading zone to get into DRC?).

It should save a lot of time...no long hover to GFI.

Items Ani Obtained that can be Assigned to X, Y, or Z in Current Low%:
1. Telescope - Obtained in opening cutscene
2. Sail - Necessary for opening triforce charts
3. Wind Waker - Necessary for Conducting wind, obtained in DRI cutscene
4. Grappling Hook - Necessary to defeat Ghoma and obtain the triforce shards
5. Tingle Tuner - Used to heal after Hovers
6. Iron Boots - Necessary to activate switch in Wind Temple
7. Spoils Bag - Obtained as prize first time in Pirate Ship, used for Joy Pendants for Cabana Deed
8. Joy Pendants - Used to get Cabana Deed
9. Delivery Bag - Necessary to holding the Cabana Deed
10. Cabana Deed - Used to enter House on Cabana Island
11. Boomerang - Used to defeat Kalle Demos & Puppet Ganon's first cycle
12. Bow (Fire/Ice Arrows & Light Arrows) [Counts as 3 items] - Necessary to defeat Gohdan, F & I to enter Earth Temple, get Triforce chart (Power Bracelets), to enter and beat Wind Temple (Iron Boots)
13. Hookshot - Necessary to Defeat Molgera
14. Bombs - Used for various hovers
15. Skull Hammer - Used in Earth Temple, currently necessary to get if skipping deku leaf.

Total Item Count:17

Items in Yellow are either impossible to avoid or, currently, absolutely necessary to complete the game.
Items in Blue are necessary for time saving tricks and skipping other items.
Items in Red could be skipped.

Note: Even though the Delivery Bag and Spoils Bag cannot be equipped, I included them because their contents can be.

Other Items that are Possible to Skip:
1. Skull Hammer - Skipping would require to get Deku Leaf, wouldn't lower item count
2. Cabana Deed - Skipping would require bottle, but would eliminate need for Delivery bag; lowers item count 
3. Light Arrows - Skipping would require bottle, but if used for skipping Cabana Deed would be worth it. Skipping would also require skipping boomerang, as Puppet Ganon now can't be defeated.
4. Boomerang - Skipping would require bottle, but would be worth it if bottle is used for light arrow and cabana deed skip.
5. Delivery Bag - Skipping requires skipping Cabana Deed; obtaining the bottle, but is worth it

Note: To preserve skipping the delivery bag and the letter to Komali, the bottle in the submarine on the way to Forest Haven would be obtained instead of the one on Dragon Roost for use in holding forest water for storage.

Effect on Previous Item Chart:
1. Telescope - Same
2. Sail - Same
3. Wind Waker - Same
4. Grappling Hook - Same
5. Tingle Tuner - Same
6. Iron Boots - Same
7. Spoils Bag - Same
8. Joy Pendants - Not necessary as we skip the Cabana Deed
9. Delivery Bag - Not necessary as we no longer need it to carry the Cabana Deed
10. Cabana Deed - Skipped by obtaining the bottle
11. Boomerang - Skipped by obtaining the bottle
12 8. Bow (Fire/Ice Arrows & Light Arrows) - Same, Light arrows skipped by obtaining the bottle
9. Bottle - Used to hold forest water so storage can be preformed; allows for multiple other item skips to lower item count
13 10. Hookshot - Same
14 11. Bombs - Same
12. Skull Hammer - Skipped as it is no longer necessary to obtain     
12. Deku Leaf - Required to skip the light arrows and also allows for Trials Skip

Total Item Count: 13

As you can see, we lowered the previous item count by replacing the Delivery Bag, Cabana Deed, and Light Arrows with the bottle and utilizing already necessary to obtain items. The Deku leaf is obtained instead of the skull hammer because it is necessary in accessing the loading zone in order to skip the Light Arrows.

Visual:
Original imageLoad image

Responding to a really old post, but how are skull hammer and deku leaf interchangeable for item count? If you skip the leaf, you can't skip light arrows or the hammer. So you can either get the leaf and skip skull hammer & light arrows (2 items), or skip the leaf, and end up getting both skull hammer and light arrows (1 item)

The BOTTLE is used to skip light arrows, it doesn't matter if you have the leaf or not.

The TRIALS however do, so if you skip the leaf, you can't skip the trials

You don't need the leaf to skip the trials do you? You can just hover to clip past the door afaik.

You can't. Even if you could, Tingle can't come in Ganon's Castle, so you'd immediately die and get taken back before the trials.

What door am I thinking of then? I'm p sure it is the same door even if it ultimately doesn't matter lol.

Avenger wrote

The BOTTLE is used to skip light arrows, it doesn't matter if you have the leaf or not.

The TRIALS however do, so if you skip the leaf, you can't skip the trials

The BOTTLE is used so you can get past the door, you need the LEAF in order to get to the door behind the wall. HOVERING can't do it cause you'll die and get spawned back in front of the wall

AniMeowzerz wrote

The BOTTLE is used so you can get past the door, you need the LEAF in order to get to the door behind the wall. HOVERING can't do it cause you'll die and get spawned back in front of the wall

Forgot about that. Will correct the list so the skull hammer is skipped.

I think I mixed up doors (Trials skip and Light Arrow skip), but I believe the inability to zombie hover past them applies to both, since not only can you not even get to the warp (as far as I know), but both also take you back before the door you aim to get past if you die in the room after said door.

So I am new to actually registering on the site but I have been following things on here for about a year now. I could have sworn I saw a YouTube video of the low% ending someone did having less items than what's posted here but I could be trippin. Is this still up-to-date even with new tricks being found all the time??

Currently, this is the minimum as far as I know. In TAS, telescope can be skipped, but there isn't an ending of a TAS. There isn't a special low% ending. And I'm awfully sure there isn't a video with less items unless it uses cheats.

Is ballad of gales skippable?

Also ani said F&I arrows are skippable on JP, is that true?

also Telescope is probably skippable w/ pause buffering

BoG is skippable.
F&I arrows are skippable on JP with forest water to get into Ice Ring. They aren't on U, because you automatically get kicked out of the volcano or ice ring.

Can you elaborate on how pause buffering could skip telescope? You need telescope to start the Tetra dropping CS, which lets you get the sword.

Wondering if low% should be done on JP (no f&i arrows), or EN (no extra charts)

skip telescope by superswimming w/ pause buffer. Should be possible

Original imageLoad image

Telescope can be skipped by superswimming.

Spoils bag can be skipped - get caught by a Moblin while swordless to enter FF1, activate Tetra text at the bottom, then just enter ship2 later (skip ship1).

I would say US. Getting the fire arrow skip on console would take a ton of tries, each requiring a new door cancel and zombie hover. For the sake of time, US would be better.

I also believe that the less charts would make a lower% than no f/i arrows. Honestly, I can't stand talking about this. Just the idea of a low% done on console with a superswim from Outset to NFI...

Edit: About superswimming on console w/ pause buffering: Unless you can get perfect pauses somehow, the best I can manage is getting a pause and wasting on frame. A turn, one empty frame, then a turn seems to max out at a very slow speed. So a perfect pause method, or just using black wind would be the best bet.

BoG Skip fun. M&C now completely broken:

Getting in: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95rPji7qBzw
Getting out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Szebvd6DjSk
Getting away: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9-4QI0nuuk

i'm working on a console, tunerless low% route.

so far i've collaborated with lots of great people to compose a route theoretically, i'm currently playing through the route to see if it is possible as well as documenting it to be a rich and detailed route

also, i vote that Spoils Bag items do not count as an item itself as those can be picked up accidentally and could consequently end a perfectly fine run.
You don't accidentally stumble upon a Boomerang after killing a Bokoblin, so we should definitely differentiate between those.
The route takes extensive use of superswims and zombie hovers (trying to keep the use of those minimal; bombs early can be achieved in two ways)
I'll post a pastebin here later tonight or tomorrow, I have so far played through the game up to Earth Temple.


PS: Earth Temple can be entered early using Chest storage; entering it before Hyrule II, however, causes the game to crash. It can be entered without power bracelets - unfortunately, the latter are required to defeat Jalhalla unless a way is discovered to kill him without.

PPS: im loving the low% route so far, it's seems like a really cool and fun category to run. Additionally, it actively trains the dry storage timing, the camera-control for superswims, navigating superswims with minimal pauses, game limits as well as zombie hovers. All around, it seems to balance fun, challenge and training perfectly.

PPPS: There actually is a third and extremely consistent way of getting Endless Night trigger by manipulating the "ventured too far" cutscene so the game allows cutscene triggers (which it doesn't normally). sadly, however, this can only be done after DRC due to the nature of the "Get in" button. i can't think of a use for that, perhaps some of you can. doing it after DRC means not skipping delivery bag and bottle, which is unacceptable to me


Edit: delayed by another day, something urgent came up.

Vulpone wrote

PPPS: There actually is a third and extremely consistent way of getting Endless Night trigger by manipulating the "ventured too far" cutscene so the game allows cutscene triggers (which it doesn't normally). sadly, however, this can only be done after DRC due to the nature of the "Get in" button. i can't think of a use for that, perhaps some of you can. doing it after DRC means not skipping delivery bag and bottle, which is unacceptable to me

Interesting, can you explain how this would work? Because I was actually searching for a way to get Nayru's pearl early (just for fun) by WW diving into Jabun's place, then hoping when swimming outside and getting in the boat, KoRL would just cruise into the whirlpool and the cutscene would activate, but that didn't happen and he just sent me all the way to Forest haven.

rust45 wrote

Interesting, can you explain how this would work? Because I was actually searching for a way to get Nayru's pearl early (just for fun) by WW diving into Jabun's place, then hoping when swimming outside and getting in the boat, KoRL would just cruise into the whirlpool and the cutscene would activate, but that didn't happen and he just sent me all the way to Forest haven.

after DRC, the boat's behavior changes as in it lets you get in the boat as opposed to having to drown to enter. with this, storage can be obtained and upon entering the boat, you store the "ventured too far" cutscene - by itself, this doesn't let us skip anything, but this does give us some of our powers back. while the boat forbids any sort of movement input (cruise and/or sail), you can use the wind waker and do stuff, for instance.

Interestingly, after pulling the Wind Waker and clicking the text, you trigger the mode in which your camera stands still and he drives off into a "allowed" zone on the great sea. Now, while this may seem like exactly the same mode as usual, this one is different in that it ALLOWS loading zones to trigger.

Currently, to my knowledge, this can only be done from Needle Rock and that reef above it... perhaps Diamond Steppe, but I haven't tested it. On all of those islands, storage can be obtained, albeit not easily (except for Diamond Steppe lol)


should be detailed enough o,o ... pretty difficult to explain, you should try it out yourself. however, as this doesn't have any use (once again, it's post-DRC only) i'd say it's only for those that like to know how things work in the game

rust45 wrote

Interesting, can you explain how this would work? Because I was actually searching for a way to get Nayru's pearl early (just for fun) by WW diving into Jabun's place, then hoping when swimming outside and getting in the boat, KoRL would just cruise into the whirlpool and the cutscene would activate, but that didn't happen and he just sent me all the way to Forest haven.

Jabun will only show up after the cutscene of the door being blown up.

I meant going into the whirlpool to knock down the barrier. But when I tried it, KoRL didn't get stuck in the whirlpool like I hoped he would.

I'm finally done with this, lol.

I've tested the route up to shard collection. I'm sort of low on time right now, so I left out that part. As the triforce shards are located near major islands (DRI, FH, Outset, GFI etc.), superswims are fairly easy to implement and if need be, a route can be improvised.

In any case, if anyone has feedback or suggestions or criticism... go ahead! :)

Here's the route for low% tuneless -- CONSOLE --:

http://pastebin.com/u2R2nCmg

Now let's see low% become a fun category, I for one love this category and will run it as soon as I have internet. The various tricks and challenges involved are amazing.

Cheers,
Vulpone


PS: List of skipped items:
- Bait Bag
- Delivery Bag
- Bottle
- Boomerang
- Ballad of Gales
- Skull Hammer
- Cabana Deed
- 5k Bag
- Magic Armor
- Pictobox

...unfortunately, due to the nature of tunerless, we need to use the DRI chest to skip delivery bag and can NOT use it to skip Cabana. All other chests on the great sea contain Treasure charts (to my knowledge), so the one on Private Oasis is best to use... so Treasure Chart #27 is used. I don't see a way around it currently.

Is door storage no good?

I think door storage gets removed when you go into another sector

You sure about that? Chest storage doesn't, so why would door... They're the same sort of thing.

Yashichidsf wrote

I think door storage gets removed when you go into another sector

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uy4eS88NntU

Using door storage on Windfall to get into Stone Watcher without the bracelets.

Revised it.

- Improved rupee route (should be 2-5 minute impovement)
- Now skips TC # 27! (thanks r0bd0g!)
- improved wind uses
- minor route changes

- video for some segments of the low% coming soon (explanatory ones)

thanks to everyone that helped! :)

http://pastebin.com/u2R2nCmg

Cheers,
Vulpone