OoT / MQ Trick Research & Discovery Thread

r0bd0g wrote

I heard from Nathan you could do the ladder RI softlock with WW RI so I decided to see if you could use RI to use items in the water.

So when you go into the water with RI, Link doesn't put the items away. So you can use them if you shield swipe. The first-person items also work while swimming.

You know this is kinda interesting because that's exactly what happens in Beta Quest, and I always wondered why. I've never actually checked if items are restricted in Beta Quest, now that I think of it...

In beta quest your scene setup is always set to 4, so you have WW RI at all times.

r0bd0g wrote

So when you go into the water with RI, Link doesn't put the items away. So you can use them if you shield swipe. The first-person items also work while swimming. This wasn't possible before with RCE RI because you can't use the shield in RCE. There's a few more oddities that aren't really worth mentioning. Not really sure what uses this could have. Maybe there's some stuff in the water temple could be done without lowing the water, IDK.

Can you explain this a bit more? Are you saying we can use items like hookshot while swimming? How exactly do you do it and how is shield swipe related?

To use items in water you jump in with them already in your hand and then shield swipe to use them. That is, you hold z&r, hold the item button and release r. The first person items work even while swimming, though the hookshot won't actually fire. You can get some very limited use of the hookshot without irons if you mash as you touch bottom.

Is it possible to have the 3rd sword slot highlighted in the inventory without having anything in it? I know that anytime you save with a non-sword item on B, it will reverse the bit for whatever sword slot is highlighted. This means you can delete or receive the Kokiri Sword, or you can delete or receive the Master Sword. I know you can delete the BGS/giants knife, but idk what it would give you if you don't have anything in that slot while it's highlighted. I don't think you can blank out that slot with RBA, and I'm sure whatever would happen wouldn't be that interesting, but I'm curious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E32rHj91jwQ

gg flameringer (yes this works in regular OoT as well)

obligatory "why didnt we think of this before???"

EDIT: Here's a video of it in OoT because I decided to record one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uw2eUv11yhw

nathanisbored wrote

obligatory "why didnt we think of this before???"

obligatory "wtf is wrong with us?"

Method of killing a Big Poe without the Bow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD5oqEcAfBU

You'd figure this would have to be an old strat, but maybe not?

r0bd0g wrote

Method of killing a Big Poe without the Bow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD5oqEcAfBU

You'd figure this would have to be an old strat, but maybe not?

The Metagame has advanced.

I wonder if there are any big poes you can kill with a superslide teleport.... You should get on that :p.

I set FW in Ingo's minigame, and then exited the minigame, and I couldn't see the warp point from outside the corral, but I could when I went back in. Does the minigame take place in a separate scene, or do different scene setups affect where the warp point is shown or something? Also, when I warped back to the FW point from outside, Ingo was standing outside the corral instead of inside. So I guess FW doesn't save the actors' positions? Or is Ingo's position based on the gamemode and whether the minigame timer is active?

nathanisbored wrote

Does the minigame take place in a separate scene

No, nor does it take place in a separate scene setup. The horse racing minigame does however take place in a cutscene setup, much like the horseback archery minigame.

Quote

Do different scene setups affect where the warp point is shown or something?

They shouldn't I would think.

Quote

Also, when I warped back to the FW point from outside, Ingo was standing outside the corral instead of inside. So I guess FW doesn't save the actors' positions? Or is Ingo's position based on the gamemode and whether the minigame timer is active?

Farore's wind only stores coordinates and temporary switch/collectible flags. Ingo's position is based on some value recording the state of that minigame or something. I think Cloudmax might know more.

mzxrules wrote

The horse racing minigame does however take place in a cutscene setup, much like the horseback archery minigame.

So you if you die in the Ingo horse riding game, or set FW and return to it, could you then hover out of the corral and go through a loading zone? Would the loading zones act differently at all kinda like horseback archery?

nathanisbored wrote

So you if you die in the Ingo horse riding game, or set FW and return to it, could you then hover out of the corral and go through a loading zone? Would the loading zones act differently at all kinda like horseback archery?

Each scene setup defines what exits are what. From a quick glance at my exit tables, the scene setup defines it's exits properly

Apparently being on fire penetrates your invincibility while on Epona, so fairy RCE doesn't have to be frame perfect. Not particularly useful, but cool I guess.

http://youtu.be/h33OUAYrAMw

New gerudo bridge mega

I found this setup for Pokey escape, I don't know if it has been found before, if it has I wasn't able to find any videos about it. It is faster than c-up method, but somewhat slower than the slash method. (video is tutorial-style for beginners, real time is obv. faster.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amH9AOovffw

It can also be done away from the wall (near the exit) by using z-target to look towards the wall used, so it can be fixed or used as a backup strat in case you miss ISG.

I was wondering if anyone has already ideas on how you could skip the Ocarina dumb minigame in LW as child (the one with the random notes and 2 skull kids).

I quickly tried Down A collection delay on the first prize, on 1.2 and 1.0, and what I tried just didn't work. Are there "underground" ways to get a collection delay, or something similar, that would change what you get ? 100% needs to find a way to remove this ><

Crazy theory: FW on B as child.

1. Get cojiro or prescription.
2. Get FW on B as adult.
3. Set FW outside Lon Lon.
4. Enter Ingo's game and mount/dismount a horse to store FW to Temp B.
5. Use FW to escape Ingo's game (windy B).
6. Do NOT ever dim the B button from now on. Trade your item for one with a timer.
7. Freeze the timer via voiding at the right time (use pit outside Ganon's Tower for voiding?)
8. Return to child.
9. Without ever dimming the B button, reach Gohma's room.
10. Do Ganondoor (windy B unrestricts ocarina in boss rooms). Remember you can't use deku nuts for a setup.
11. Reach the Ganon fight (idk if the collapse timer will screw up the stored item timer).
12. After Ganon makes you swordless, use saria's song to unfreeze the timer.
13. After warping back to lost woods or whatever, make your way back to Lon Lon (during daytime), making sure B never dims on the way.
14. Upon entering LLR, your blank B should turn back into Temp B (which is hopefully FW, assuming the Ganon fight doesn't affect Temp B).
15. FW on B as child?? It would be blank again if you savewarp, die, run out a timer, or get caught by guards.

There's probably a bunch of roadblocks I didn't account for, or other reasons this won't work. It's very possible after doing all this you will just end up with blank B in the end. I'm also worried about the collapse timer. Anyway, I might not get around to testing this for awhile, but if anyone else wants to I figure I'd post it here.

EDIT: If this did work, you could probably also get any item value between 20-55 on B as child too. Just store one of these items to Temp B, BA FW, and THEN do windy B (and don't mount/dismount the horse in Ingo's minigame).

So I tested this on v1.0 emu.

1. You can't use Ganon's Tower to void out as I suspected, since it's not actually a "void". However, there are plenty of places you can get OoB to stop the timer.
2. Ganon's Castle timer overwrites the timer.
3. I just used OI to warp away.
4. When I got to LLR as child my B button stayed blank although Temp B was still FW.

Jbop wrote

So I tested this on v1.0 emu.

1. You can't use Ganon's Tower to void out as I suspected, since it's not actually a "void". However, there are plenty of places you can get OoB to stop the timer.
2. Ganon's Castle timer overwrites the timer.
3. I just used OI to warp away.
4. When I got to LLR as child my B button stayed blank although Temp B was still FW.

How did you use OI to warp away? During windy B, you can't use warp songs.

nathanisbored wrote

How did you use OI to warp away? During windy B, you can't use warp songs.

Well after I "escaped" LLR I reentered the ranch to undim my C-buttons. Idk if that messes anything up (thinking now I believe it might hehe), but there was no other way to trade items :/

Jbop wrote

Well after I "escaped" LLR I reentered the ranch to undim my C-buttons. Idk if that messes anything up (thinking now I believe it might hehe), but there was no other way to trade items :/

Oh duh, I forgot you can't trade items LOL
I'm guessing the Ingo game timer overwrites the item timer too, and you can't get it back?

nathanisbored wrote

Oh duh, I forgot you can't trade items LOL
I'm guessing the Ingo game timer overwrites the item timer too, and you can't get it back?

I'm not exactly sure what you mean, but the Ingo timer and item timer are each one of the different types of timers (which I aptly like to call "white" and yellow" OpieOP), so they don't overwrite one another.

Jbop wrote

I'm not exactly sure what you mean, but the Ingo timer and item timer are each one of the different types of timers (which I aptly like to call "white" and yellow" OpieOP), so they don't overwrite one another.

Well I mean, could you store the timer before doing Windy B? And would you still have it afterwards? Basically we need a way to escape the Ganon battle with Windy B still active, because entering LLR with Windy B active with a non-sword item on B restores Temp B. So it's the only way to directly restore Temp B as Child.

nathanisbored wrote

Well I mean, could you store the timer before doing Windy B? And would you still have it afterwards? Basically we need a way to escape the Ganon battle with Windy B still active, because entering LLR with Windy B active with a non-sword item on B restores Temp B. So it's the only way to directly restore Temp B as Child.

Ah I understand now. Yeah I don't see why you wouldn't be able to store the timer before hand, unless the Ingo text triggers the warp. Even so, you should still be able to have the timer running and do the Ingo minigame if need be.

EDIT: OK tried it, and it works! However it works slightly differently lol. Here are the steps and what happened:

1. Got FW on B.
2. Got Mushroom + Timer.
3. Set FW outside LLR.
4. Went in to LLR, did Ingo minigame, mounted/dismounted horse.
5. Escaped with Windy B.
6. Waited for the Ingo timer to run out, and after it did the item timer ran out because I used FW.
7. I used L to Levitate to void out and timer stop (although you could easily get OoB somewhere).
8. Went back to child.
9. Used a couple cheats to get to Gohma's room and wrong warp, simply because I had not previously beaten the dungeon.
10. During the CS with Zelda I noticed the HUD remained onscreen, which was interesting...
11. Went down Castle Escape normally w/ cheats, but I believe you'd have to void warp and die and then revive with a fairy or something to do it legit. The castle timer overwrote the timer lol I forgot that >_>
12. Got to Ganon fight and during the CS once again the HUD was visible for w/e reason lol
13. After Ganon knocked my sword away I had FW on B (? ? ?), but no way to warp away afaik.

So I didn't need to even go back to LLR or have the timer I guess, but I can't do anything with it >.<

Jbop wrote

Ah I understand now. Yeah I don't see why you wouldn't be able to store the timer before hand, unless the Ingo text triggers the warp. Even so, you should still be able to have the timer running and do the Ingo minigame if need be.

EDIT: OK tried it, and it works! However it works slightly differently lol. Here are the steps and what happened:

1. Got FW on B.
2. Got Mushroom + Timer.
3. Set FW outside LLR.
4. Went in to LLR, did Ingo minigame, mounted/dismounted horse.
5. Escaped with Windy B.
6. Waited for the Ingo timer to run out, and after it did the item timer ran out because I used FW.
7. I used L to Levitate to void out and timer stop (although you could easily get OoB somewhere).
8. Went back to child.
9. Used a couple cheats to get to Gohma's room and wrong warp, simply because I had not previously beaten the dungeon.
10. During the CS with Zelda I noticed the HUD remained onscreen, which was interesting...
11. Went down Castle Escape normally w/ cheats, but I believe you'd have to void warp and die and then revive with a fairy or something to do it legit. The castle timer overwrote the timer lol I forgot that >_>
12. Got to Ganon fight and during the CS once again the HUD was visible for w/e reason lol
13. After Ganon knocked my sword away I had FW on B (? ? ?), but no way to warp away afaik.

So I didn't need to even go back to LLR or have the timer I guess, but I can't do anything with it >.<

Huh, that's really weird that you didn't have to go back to LLR... Does FW (real FW) work right after the wrong warp still? If so maybe you could set it to warp back once you get FW on B.

I just tested and it works! I'll upload a video soonish.

nathanisbored wrote

I just tested and it works! I'll upload a video soonish.

Great!
Also I forgot to say that when I was testing, after the Ganon-knocks-away-your-nonexistent-Master-Sword cutscene, I hilariously tried to figure out ways to escape for like 15 minutes without even realizing FW was on B lmao

I wonder, would this work on 1.1 and 1.2 the same way?

EDIT: Idk why I said void warp would be necessary; I forgot you had Kokiri sword! Dang I really wasn't paying attention to the B button was I? ::)

Does anybody remember what we were going to do with child ba if we ever found it, or did we not think that far ahead?