http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCzApHRaOFE
doubt it's useful, but I find it interesting how 'continue' gives 3 hearts
doubt it's useful, but I find it interesting how 'continue' gives 3 hearts
Wow, that's crazy. Only place I can think of would be Light Arrow skip. But of course, that requires forest water and you could just use the storage method. Still, nice find.
Actually, now I think about it, this can be used for any length of hover, if you do the hover before the fake death cutscene and then trigger the cutscene + get knocked off at the top.
So I guess this is a kinda 'hover to anywhere using forest water' providing the ledge you're trying to get to has some kind of enemy or object to push you. Saying that, I can't think of a single place where we actually need to start and land a hover without going through a loading zone.
So I guess this is a kinda 'hover to anywhere using forest water' providing the ledge you're trying to get to has some kind of enemy or object to push you. Saying that, I can't think of a single place where we actually need to start and land a hover without going through a loading zone.
I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Pretty much if you enter FF1 by means of moblin and you don't finish FF1, you will always warp back to Outset from save and quit or death. This not only saves time, but may have interesting effects in Hyrule. Right now I'm testing this, but I'm thinking FF1 ending skip + Hyrule 2 save exit may be interesting.
I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Pretty much if you enter FF1 by means of moblin and you don't finish FF1, you will always warp back to Outset from save and quit or death. This not only saves time, but may have interesting effects in Hyrule. Right now I'm testing this, but I'm thinking FF1 ending skip + Hyrule 2 save exit may be interesting.
Can you go about getting the sword without completing FF1? Do you keep the sword even if you die? I've never messed with this, so I'm unsure.
I doubt the sword would be kept, since that would let us rape moblins prematurely via quit save.
Can you go about getting the sword without completing FF1? Do you keep the sword even if you die? I've never messed with this, so I'm unsure.
Assuming the sword is not kept as long as FF1 isn't completed, I'd like to see this tested:
1. Get sword and leave FF1 without finishing it.
2. Get past that Tower of the Gods dead-end where it can't be beaten without the sword.
3. Save and quit.
4. If still swordless (probably not at this point), proceed to Hyrule and pick up the Master Sword.
5. With the Master Sword, return to FF1 and pick up the sword there.
Will the sword left in FF1 overwrite the Master Sword? Or will it be gone as it may become FF2 since getting the Master Sword is a plot advancing trigger?
Last edited 10 May 2012, 23:11 by Jeville.
Since you normally stay in ff1 with a save quit, you do keep the sword. I can't go into too NIH depth because I'm on a phone right now.
Here's what I've learned. I'll be in-depth as not to rule out possibilities.
I got the NFI rupee upgrade and got sail. Then bottle and forest water. I activated endless night. I went to ff1, turned off searchlight, activated tetra text, got sword. I save quit and reset. I was at Outset. I got bombs and did DRC. I did forbidden woods. I did ff2 skipping skull hammer. Here's the interesting thing.
During the ganon cutscene, it went normally. Before going to hyrule, I was on KoRL in the CS. ToG did not appear. When going to Hyrule, I appeared on the ground during the CS, no KoRL. It was gray like hyrule 1 skip usually is. The camera got messed up during the CS and the cutscene finished. Then I got a crash right before getting control. It was the crash where you see the screen but it buzzes and there is of course, a hard crash. Had to hit power button.
Not sure what this means. I'm trying again later today.
Another thing I am theorizing. Similar to how ff has ff1, ff2, ff3. The ocean has different versions. There is the starting version. This stays at day iirc until some event happens. This somewhat explains the FoF crash. There is another version which is right after ff1. This is kind of like a cutscene ocean. In this version, FF is in what I will call ff0. It is ff2 with no spikes, no searchlights, no cannons, no PG, and no door at the top. Entering any door goes to the interior and when you exit it goes to the normal ocean and normal ff2. Another sign of this is that even if you are in endless night, the actors at windfall are there right after ff1. ANOTHER sign is that in my TAS, when you exit the bomb shop it activates the KoRL coming to windfall after greatfish cutscene. I also assume that islands have their own versions, and that is why the water around some unloads if you get too close too fast. The reason for ff0 is that it stays in the same state for the cutscene after ff1, where you see it but it is blank (check me on this one). THats about all I can think of off the top of my head. I may stream ff0 later, probably more ff1 ending skip.
Here's what I've learned. I'll be in-depth as not to rule out possibilities.
I got the NFI rupee upgrade and got sail. Then bottle and forest water. I activated endless night. I went to ff1, turned off searchlight, activated tetra text, got sword. I save quit and reset. I was at Outset. I got bombs and did DRC. I did forbidden woods. I did ff2 skipping skull hammer. Here's the interesting thing.
During the ganon cutscene, it went normally. Before going to hyrule, I was on KoRL in the CS. ToG did not appear. When going to Hyrule, I appeared on the ground during the CS, no KoRL. It was gray like hyrule 1 skip usually is. The camera got messed up during the CS and the cutscene finished. Then I got a crash right before getting control. It was the crash where you see the screen but it buzzes and there is of course, a hard crash. Had to hit power button.
Not sure what this means. I'm trying again later today.
Another thing I am theorizing. Similar to how ff has ff1, ff2, ff3. The ocean has different versions. There is the starting version. This stays at day iirc until some event happens. This somewhat explains the FoF crash. There is another version which is right after ff1. This is kind of like a cutscene ocean. In this version, FF is in what I will call ff0. It is ff2 with no spikes, no searchlights, no cannons, no PG, and no door at the top. Entering any door goes to the interior and when you exit it goes to the normal ocean and normal ff2. Another sign of this is that even if you are in endless night, the actors at windfall are there right after ff1. ANOTHER sign is that in my TAS, when you exit the bomb shop it activates the KoRL coming to windfall after greatfish cutscene. I also assume that islands have their own versions, and that is why the water around some unloads if you get too close too fast. The reason for ff0 is that it stays in the same state for the cutscene after ff1, where you see it but it is blank (check me on this one). THats about all I can think of off the top of my head. I may stream ff0 later, probably more ff1 ending skip.
Will the sword left in FF1 overwrite the Master Sword? Or will it be gone as it may become FF2 since getting the Master Sword is a plot advancing trigger?
Ff1 and ff2 are different maps. No plot advancing trigger changes that. To get to ff1 you get caught by a moblin. Ff2 advances to ff3 after finishing the helmaroc battle by entering ganons room.
Yay triple post.
So here's what I got today.
1. Do the intro up to watching Tetra fall.
2. Complete FF1 getting there with a moblin.
3. The pirate ship will still be by Outset.
4. Enter and you will be in the pirate ship 2 and you can get bombs without endless night.
Sadly, endless night is needed to get the door on the back of Jabun's cave to appear, so you can't skip it. But if someone thinks that the intro is faster than the trip to Windfall and the bomb shop CS, well, idk. Seems ridiculous that this could be faster, even in TAS. Well, it'll be TAS only. Pretty much it'd be this:
Hop off tower.
Clothes.
Telescope.
Tetra fall.
Superswim to NFI and use moblin to go to FF1.
FF1.
At Windfall, buy sail to avoid sail softlock.
Free Tingle.
Superswim to Outset.
Zombie hover from Outset onto the pirate ship.
All I got for now.
So here's what I got today.
1. Do the intro up to watching Tetra fall.
2. Complete FF1 getting there with a moblin.
3. The pirate ship will still be by Outset.
4. Enter and you will be in the pirate ship 2 and you can get bombs without endless night.
Sadly, endless night is needed to get the door on the back of Jabun's cave to appear, so you can't skip it. But if someone thinks that the intro is faster than the trip to Windfall and the bomb shop CS, well, idk. Seems ridiculous that this could be faster, even in TAS. Well, it'll be TAS only. Pretty much it'd be this:
Hop off tower.
Clothes.
Telescope.
Tetra fall.
Superswim to NFI and use moblin to go to FF1.
FF1.
At Windfall, buy sail to avoid sail softlock.
Free Tingle.
Superswim to Outset.
Zombie hover from Outset onto the pirate ship.
All I got for now.
Zombie hover from Outset onto the pirate ship.
How do you plan to heal out of this hover?
Tingle Tuner.
How do you plan to heal out of this hover?
It would have to be tuner. This route would be crazy. When I get a chance I may make a quick sloppy TAS of it up to getting bombs. Idk about rupees either. You need to get sail before bombs, because to get off the ship needs a savewarp and then the KoRL is a bitch.
Last edited 12 May 2012, 21:54 by Abahbob.
So Dolphin has tuner support finally? Because this theoretical routing/TAS'ing it up until where you need it is just proving to be disappointing speculation. :-\
It would have to be tuner. This route would be crazy. When I get a chance I may make a quick sloppy TAS of it up to getting bombs. Idk about rupees either. You need to get sail before bombs, because to get off the ship needs a savewarp and then the KoRL is a bitch.
No support yet :/ I'll just use the d-pad right to heal code or something. Idk if I'll TAS it, seems long.
I wouldn't count on the tuner ever working in dolphin.
I personally think it will eventually. I just doubt it will be within a reasonable period of time. And I doubt that it will sync well. Let's just hope it comes sooner than later.
K, I just did it on console and it ended up about 20 minutes from control to getting bombs. This doesn't include the zombie hover or freeing Tingle, which I forgot. I'm going to upload the full thing to youtube just as a proof of concept.
K, I just did it on console and it ended up about 20 minutes from control to getting bombs. This doesn't include the zombie hover or freeing Tingle, which I forgot. I'm going to upload the full thing to youtube just as a proof of concept.
Last edited 13 May 2012, 05:46 by Abahbob.
So Dolphin has tuner support finally? Because this theoretical routing/TAS'ing it up until where you need it is just proving to be disappointing speculation. :-\
I agree with Pheenoh, everything TAS I'm looking into is tuner-less because it'll just end up like all those barrier skip routes which have never actually gone anywhere because barrier skip was never found.
Yeah, well maybe with a full magic meter and some epic leaf pumping you could make it. Or some crazy superswim momentum. But still, if it manages to lead to some major break, then I want to find it. I hate thinking about how this wouldn't work without tuner, but it is still worth finding out that it works. It leads to more interesting information about how the game works. But I won't count on this ever becoming part of the route.
About speed sidling (mashing a direction while Link is sidling), I think I figured it out somewhat.
When Link isn't "headed" towards a direction (when he is just idling in one spot, or about to idle), mashing a direction to gain distance works. I don't know what the perfect input would be for a TAS, though. It doesn't work if you head into a direction and then start mashing every other or every third frame.
In this unoptimized test I did here, I saved about 100 frames.
Original image
When Link isn't "headed" towards a direction (when he is just idling in one spot, or about to idle), mashing a direction to gain distance works. I don't know what the perfect input would be for a TAS, though. It doesn't work if you head into a direction and then start mashing every other or every third frame.
In this unoptimized test I did here, I saved about 100 frames.
Original image
Today, I was thinking about getting the triforce before hyrule 1 or 2. MAY be possible in TAS, doubt it though. Anyways, its hand interesting results.
Getting the Triforce before hyrule 1, but after raising ToG, and then completing ff2 is strange. Hyrule 2 turns into a hybrid of all 3 hyrules. The colors are gone still. The triforce blocks need to be pushed. When you enter the chamber, Zelda is standing infront of Master Sword. The MS isn't drawn, like Hyrule 1 skip usually is. Zelda infront of the sword is the Hyrule 3 cutscene. When you approach, she disappears and the 2 darknut fight happens. They are both gray. After ending the fight, the fire disappears. When you leave, you instantly fadeout and the Hyrule 2 cutscene where Tetra becomes Zelda is loaded. You appear in the chamber next to Tetra, but you can move and no cutscene occurs. You can walk right through her. Leaving goes into normal Hyrule and the barrier is not breakable. After leaving and trying to complete ToG, I crashed after finishing the boss and the quick cutscene afterwards. I didn't get to ring the bell.
Here's something even more fun, a dead-end. Complete Hyrule 1, then get the Triforce, then go to Hyrule 2. The cutscene of you talking with Tetra won't occur. Tetra won't appear. KoRL won't talk. You can get in and leave. Inside, the chamber is closed. The electric barrier is blocking the way to the barrier. There is no way to open the chamber. If you leave on KoRL, he won't talk. You won't even be able to talk to him later. The sea chart doesn't show where to go. You can't get Fire and Ice arrows. Good game.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CVzmB-rruQ
Complete Hyrule 1, get Triforce, then go to Hyrule 2. Strange effects. Pretty much, the statue is in place on top of the chamber. In order to get into the chamber, you need to clip under the castle (Using Mugg's method for the Hyrule 1 fight skip). Entering the chamber activates the Hyrule 3 Zelda Cutscene/fight. When you leave the chamber, the Hyrule 2 cutscene loads, but doesn't play. You are standing infront of the Master Sword pedestal and Tetra is standing next to you, and she has no collision. Leaving now works, the statue is still in place. You can walk right through it. If you go to the barrier, the electric barrier blocking you from it disappears. Klydestorm said that that is one of the requirements for being able to brake the barrier. Sadly, since you don't have the MS3, you can't break the barrier. At this point, leaving causes the KoRL to give the Hyrule 2 text. If you talk with him again, he gives the text after the Hyrule 3 fight telling you to go to Ganon. Seems like no skip here yet. The temples are shown as places to go on the Sea Chart.
Getting the Triforce before hyrule 1, but after raising ToG, and then completing ff2 is strange. Hyrule 2 turns into a hybrid of all 3 hyrules. The colors are gone still. The triforce blocks need to be pushed. When you enter the chamber, Zelda is standing infront of Master Sword. The MS isn't drawn, like Hyrule 1 skip usually is. Zelda infront of the sword is the Hyrule 3 cutscene. When you approach, she disappears and the 2 darknut fight happens. They are both gray. After ending the fight, the fire disappears. When you leave, you instantly fadeout and the Hyrule 2 cutscene where Tetra becomes Zelda is loaded. You appear in the chamber next to Tetra, but you can move and no cutscene occurs. You can walk right through her. Leaving goes into normal Hyrule and the barrier is not breakable. After leaving and trying to complete ToG, I crashed after finishing the boss and the quick cutscene afterwards. I didn't get to ring the bell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CVzmB-rruQ
Complete Hyrule 1, get Triforce, then go to Hyrule 2. Strange effects. Pretty much, the statue is in place on top of the chamber. In order to get into the chamber, you need to clip under the castle (Using Mugg's method for the Hyrule 1 fight skip). Entering the chamber activates the Hyrule 3 Zelda Cutscene/fight. When you leave the chamber, the Hyrule 2 cutscene loads, but doesn't play. You are standing infront of the Master Sword pedestal and Tetra is standing next to you, and she has no collision. Leaving now works, the statue is still in place. You can walk right through it. If you go to the barrier, the electric barrier blocking you from it disappears. Klydestorm said that that is one of the requirements for being able to brake the barrier. Sadly, since you don't have the MS3, you can't break the barrier. At this point, leaving causes the KoRL to give the Hyrule 2 text. If you talk with him again, he gives the text after the Hyrule 3 fight telling you to go to Ganon. Seems like no skip here yet. The temples are shown as places to go on the Sea Chart.
Last edited 15 May 2012, 22:54 by Abahbob.
This needs to be tested on jap version, because the cs automatically loads when you reach the barrier instead of you having to swing the sword. Maybe the flags will be different in the japanese version?
Hmm, perhaps. I would assume it's the same requirements, but maybe not. I still need to get a Jpn version. Need moneyz.
i hovered without turbo lol on top of ToG from an island
rung the bell, nothing happened
saved
beat ToG
after I beat it, the bell ringing cutscene started automatically.
rung the bell, nothing happened
saved
beat ToG
after I beat it, the bell ringing cutscene started automatically.
I knew if you hovered up and rang it nothing happened, but the latter is pretty interesting.
i hovered without turbo lol on top of ToG from an island
rung the bell, nothing happened
saved
beat ToG
after I beat it, the bell ringing cutscene started automatically.
I tried telling you what would happen in your stream chat (it was flooding by your fans), I've tested it with cheats before and the same happened.
You may have succeeded in lowering the IL time Cosmo, if the dungeon is timed from entrance to bell ring, a runner could ring the bell before doing the dungeon, cut out some time
But that's just insane :}
You may have succeeded in lowering the IL time Cosmo, if the dungeon is timed from entrance to bell ring, a runner could ring the bell before doing the dungeon, cut out some time
But that's just insane :}
You may have succeeded in lowering the IL time Cosmo, if the dungeon is timed from entrance to bell ring, a runner could ring the bell before doing the dungeon, cut out some time
I would think the hover would take more time than just ringing the bell after you beat the dungeon.
But don't mind me, I just lurk in this thread and throw stuff in every now and then.
EDIT: just noticed you said the IL time. Aren't IL's measured from the beginning of the dungeon to the warp out? In that case, it would be unnecessary but fun. And gruelling, since it's zombie hover. Without turbo.
Cosmo, you are a TWW god. A little late for this, but congrats on the sub-6:00:00. A great run.
Last edited 20 May 2012, 13:23 by SamusXLink.
Aren't IL's measured from the beginning of the dungeon to the warp out?
Yep.
New earth temple BK skip at 9:03:00: http://www.twitch.tv/cosmowright/b/318873558
Tingle balloon should also work for DRC if you use it instead of leaf in this video, unless you can't grab that ledge without the leaf: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPgGmYH_nUo
Tingle balloon should also work for DRC if you use it instead of leaf in this video, unless you can't grab that ledge without the leaf: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPgGmYH_nUo
Last edited 21 May 2012, 17:37 by Slowking.
Hi, I just found some tricks in the Forbidden Woods, and it may save some seconds.
In the fourth room of the dungeon, you need to use a Boko nut on a plant to open the door. But you can also use a Boko stick dropped by a Boko Baba to open the door! You need to throw the Boko stick to the plant twice to kill it and open the door, and I think it's faster than using the Boko nut like Cosmo does in his runs, but it's a bit luck based, because when you throw the stick the first time, it may fall off the ledge.
By the way, if you blow the leaves at the entrance of this room with a Tingle bomb, a purple rupee will appear! It may be useful and costs no more than 5 seconds. There's a lot of places where Tingle can make rupees appear!
There is also a faster way to enter the Forbidden Woods, if the wind is blowing to west, you can reach FW from the Forest Heaven with a Tingle Balloon and Deku Leaf without going to the small island. It costs some time to call Tingle but you'll need him later for zombie hover anyway. It's faster than the normal way, but I don't know if it's faster than Cosmo's way...
I hope this will be useful!
In the fourth room of the dungeon, you need to use a Boko nut on a plant to open the door. But you can also use a Boko stick dropped by a Boko Baba to open the door! You need to throw the Boko stick to the plant twice to kill it and open the door, and I think it's faster than using the Boko nut like Cosmo does in his runs, but it's a bit luck based, because when you throw the stick the first time, it may fall off the ledge.
By the way, if you blow the leaves at the entrance of this room with a Tingle bomb, a purple rupee will appear! It may be useful and costs no more than 5 seconds. There's a lot of places where Tingle can make rupees appear!
There is also a faster way to enter the Forbidden Woods, if the wind is blowing to west, you can reach FW from the Forest Heaven with a Tingle Balloon and Deku Leaf without going to the small island. It costs some time to call Tingle but you'll need him later for zombie hover anyway. It's faster than the normal way, but I don't know if it's faster than Cosmo's way...
I hope this will be useful!
New earth temple BK skip at 9:03:00: http://www.twitch.tv/cosmowright/b/318873558
Tingle balloon should also work for DRC if you use it instead of leaf in this video, unless you can't grab that ledge without the leaf: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPgGmYH_nUo
I didn't know you could land in that spot, but I believe that you can also glide to the loading zone after clipping if you start leafing soon enough.
For the DRC thing, the leaf is not completely necessary to clip, but clipping with just the pot and no leaf is very difficult and random. You can place the pot below the spot in the video and climb up and clip then try to time a tingle balloon perfectly so as soon as you clip it activates, but that would be extremely difficult and would require ridiculous precision.