WW Tricks and Glitches Discussion

It's all very well proposing a theory like that, but normally theories have some kind of ground to work on. To say you'll somehow do this and somehow do that is meaningless, because without having specific ideas for techniques used to do them, your theories are about as solid as me saying "I'm going to somehow wrong warp from Grandma's house to the Ganon battle with Light Arrows and fully powered MS, but I don't know how yet". As much as what you're proposing would be great for speedrunning Wind Waker, you have to be realistic and work with the mechanics of the game; otherwise you're just making up theories that'll never work. The foundation of your theory is an EMS with no input on how it's going to work and on top of that you have trial skips and a Puppet Ganon skip, which several players have tried and got nowhere with.

It's great that you want to help break this game and I hate to sound like I'm just shooting down all your ideas, but I think you'd be much more help if you just kept your ideas realistic and work with what we have now.

Ok, I found a lot of dive spot here and there but I can't dive deep. I stay splashing on the surface like in the Kazooie's Windfall Island video.
So I just wanted to know, what are the conditions to dive deeper?

Where have you been diving?

Earth and wind island, all of the dice island (but we don't care and there's no use).

Entrering earth temple by diving could lead to bracelet skip.

Majora MIM wrote

Earth and wind island, all of the dice island (but we don't care and there's no use).

Entrering earth temple by diving could lead to bracelet skip.

I was SO but I mean SO close for skipping bracelet skip. I dived under there but the loading zone is a bit more to the top and we cant reach it. I forgot to put in on video but i think ill do it sooner or later.

Your upgrade theory, it doesn't work for Bombs, so I doubt it's going to work for Arrows.

bluephantom340 wrote

I was SO but I mean SO close for skipping bracelet skip. I dived under there but the loading zone is a bit more to the top and we cant reach it. I forgot to put in on video but i think ill do it sooner or later.

I still want to know how to dive deeper.
Maybe there's still a way using Tingle's bomb, or Tingle's baloon...

You still need the bracelets to get to SL, so you'd need to find a way to skip that too. I think you need it for the 101 rupee trick too, but that's not mandatory.

The chart you get in the 101 (theres more than one, but there is a faster one, do the other one only once) grotto is.

I just found this today, Moving while carrying heavy objects: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FhWLYDUyKw

It gives me new idea. Maybe by letting end a forest water timer at the same time you're talking to someone or opening a chest or a door, it will have interresting consequences like unloaded rooms or riching unloaded area.

Majora MIM wrote

I just found this today, Moving while carrying heavy objects: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FhWLYDUyKw

It gives me new idea. Maybe by letting end a forest water timer at the same time you're talking to someone or opening a chest or a door, it will have interresting consequences like unloaded rooms or riching unloaded area.

Sounds practical and very useful. Also, I like you're new icon.
@Phazon
I do have an idea of how to get my theory to work and always have. I haven't told anyone about it, however, because I don't need people to say,"That's not going to work." Most of us didn't think that you could move while lifting heavy objects, but MajoraMIM proved that possible.
@Klyde
Never say never.

O_o how the hell do you kill PG without MS?
And don't we need the skull hammer in wind temple. (and to enter wind temple to)?


trust in the forest water, it will lead us to victory

Anyway, to skip helmaroc king, I'm thinking of placing a bomb near the spike wall, and go on the side spike. Then jump+deku leaf and get damage boost. I've been able to climb another wall of almost the same height by the same method in FF.

Tingle doesn't follow you in boss battle but even if he would, I'm almost sure we can't use tingle's baloon in FF. My original plan was to use tingle's baloon from side spike then jumpslash from air with damage boost to get on the spike wall.

I'm pretty sure the timer is paused when you talk to someone. If not you could get in a body of water, talk to KoRL and never drown, which would make early FF2 possible.

EDIT:

@Razor Actually I never even thought about moving with heavy objects lol. I'm not saying what you're planning isn't possible. Anything is possible. I'm just saying, how likely is it that you're going to find what you need for your theories? I'd love for you to find a big break in WW and I wish you good luck, but I'm still sceptical. Sorry.

As for the M&C problem. For now I think we should assume that we'd get the Bow from ToG. 5 minutes to get the Bow is the least of our worries.

An idea that I'm pretty sure won't work, but it doesn't hurt to test. Try hitting PG after drinking soup.

Can't you get into the Wind Temple with Power Bracelets?

No, you need hammer skull to get in the wind temple. Even if we can clip through, we'll still need it inside the temple...

Majora MIM wrote

O_o how the hell do you kill PG without MS?
And don't we need the skull hammer in wind temple. (and to enter wind temple to)?

1: You don't.
2: You don't need it INSIDE the Temple, if I remember right. Just for the one room with the Hookshot, but you can S&Q to get out.

Anyhow, EMS isn't going to happen. Too many invisible walls blocking us off.

What happens when you hit PG with a regular sword? Does he flinch as if he was hit, but takes no damage or does nothing happen at all?

Nothing happens when you hit him with the Hero's Sword. It can't even reflect his blasts back at him.

Every other item was tested against him, too. Nothing works. Not even a Deku Stick.

Majora MIM wrote

I just found this today, Moving while carrying heavy objects: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FhWLYDUyKw

It gives me new idea. Maybe by letting end a forest water timer at the same time you're talking to someone or opening a chest or a door, it will have interresting consequences like unloaded rooms or riching unloaded area.

Very nice.

Phazon wrote

I'm pretty sure the timer is paused when you talk to someone. If not you could get in a body of water, talk to KoRL and never drown, which would make early FF2 possible.

EDIT:

@Razor Actually I never even thought about moving with heavy objects lol. I'm not saying what you're planning isn't possible. Anything is possible. I'm just saying, how likely is it that you're going to find what you need for your theories? I'd love for you to find a big break in WW and I wish you good luck, but I'm still sceptical. Sorry.

As for the M&C problem. For now I think we should assume that we'd get the Bow from ToG. 5 minutes to get the Bow is the least of our worries.

I like the increase in your enthusiasm. The reason why we all think this is impossible is because the glitch knowledge we have in that area is very low. It's like before the DoT skip in OoT, no one would have ever thought it possible to skip all child dungeons.

KlydeStorm wrote

-Find a way to escape M&C Isles after getting Fire/Ice Arrows by diving into it. Fire/Ice Arrows replaces the regular Bow as a completely different item, and will work just like the bow.

What items does the fire/ice arrows replace the regular bow with? And/or what is the items icon? Just curious.

Razor wrote

What items does the fire/ice arrows replace the regular bow with? And/or what is the items icon? Just curious.

It replaces the regular Bow with the Fire/Ice Bow.

Normally, you need the Bow to get the Ballad of Gales to get the Fire/Ice Bow.

And I assume it would work the same with Light Arrows replacing the Fire/Ice Bow with Fire/Ice/Light Bow, as to get the Light Arrows you need the Fire/Ice Bow to get that far.

So, BoG is the test for if you can get I / F arrows? It would have to be more, becuase then we would just get arrows then get BoG. Having the MS would make sence as a trigger. Another way of programing that would be a check for if you don't have the Hero Sword...

You think swordless glitch could actually be useful?

Phazon wrote

You think swordless glitch could actually be useful?

Exactly what I was thinking. I'm sure that there's some way that Ani's swordless link glitch could be useful, but it just needs a good spot to be incorparated into a speedrun. I've been wondering about that for a while.

MrSparkle wrote

So, BoG is the test for if you can get I / F arrows? It would have to be more, becuase then we would just get arrows then get BoG. Having the MS would make sence as a trigger. Another way of programing that would be a check for if you don't have the Hero Sword...

Ballad of Gales is not the trigger at all. I'm not sure where you got that.

The trigger for being able to get them is completing FF2. The reason we need Ballad of Gales is to escape M&C. If you dive under it and activate the scene, your boat appears with you in the scene, and is stuck inside M&C. Without Ballad of Gales, you're stuck for good.

Razor wrote

Exactly what I was thinking. I'm sure that there's some way that Ani's swordless link glitch could be useful, but it just needs a good spot to be incorparated into a speedrun. I've been wondering about that for a while.

I've confirmed about 5 months ago that Swordless glitch isn't useful at all. I've gotten up to the master sword swordless and nothing weird happens. Just like if you were beating the game normally. Also FYI, Ani didn't find that trick. Unreal did IIRC.

Yes, it was Unreal who discovered it, I just documented it on video + played with some of it.

I have to admit, my knowledge on the swordless glitch is close to nothing. I may have to watch Ani's vid for like the 5th time and try to actually remember stuff x_X.

Can you get into M&C without BoG? I mean, if you warp there are you just warped to a room that isn't there if you try to get in from the outside of the island, maybe because the programmers assumed that getting in without BoG was impossible?

KlydeStorm wrote

Normally, you need the Bow to get the Ballad of Gales to get the Fire/Ice Bow.

Thats where I got it. Either way, I was just using it as a platform to mention the random idea I had as i read the new posts. But yeah, I forgot you do ff2 before IF arrows...

Phazon wrote

Can you get into M&C without BoG? I mean, if you warp there are you just warped to a room that isn't there if you try to get in from the outside of the island, maybe because the programmers assumed that getting in without BoG was impossible?

Well, if you read what I've been posting, it'd be clear...

You can get in without BoG by WW Diving. However, you cannot get out without BoG. The scene activates just fine, everything goes accordingly.

It's official, ww low% is possible, now. And they say its hopeless, thats a major accomplishment...