BiT Research Topic

Keys are dungeoun/area specific. I say are because the goron key for sand sea and the lanayru gorge keys work also. The second theory is proven.

Yea, that was already known. Although the key for the gorge and the Sand Sea are interchangeable. I guess the game considers them the same dungeons or something. You can use any key obtained in a dungeon on any door in the dungeon. So you could skip the first door and use the key on the second door. Unfortunately, there is no place where that is useful.

Edit: Dangit, Abahbob beat me to the punch!

My theory about "if we could go through the wall" gets you the harp early.

I think the problem with that though would be that even if you could skip LMF and get harp you still need the bellows in other places i think, so it would be like skipping sailcloth, useful in a harp run but a dead end in any%

Well all early ToT attempts have failed ion the past. If you can get it to work though, that would be great. You can just do it after you get the bellows. Sure to save like 7 minutes from skipping the second half of LMF. And in a Harp run, it would save like 25 minutes. All wishful thinking I'm afraid.

If you could avoid needing the Bellows until Bokoblin Base you could get away with it, but that might be a bit of a stretch.

Theres that one miniboss type guy in the desert thats buried in the sand that you need bellows to fight so I dont think its possible to skip, even if you could get harp w/o LMF.

I never said anything about skipping the wind item, just everything else.

If by everything else you include the first two temples, you can't get to lanayru before them
If you just mean the second half of LMF then okay. Good luck getting over the wall haha

If you could get early ToT, you would go through the dungeon backwards, skipping the entire Lanaryu Desert Section. But again, this is all theoretical. First find a way into ToT, then we can talk about how it is sequence breaks. It is clear it would be worth it, but it's probably impossible with current known glitches.

You couldnt go through backwards, as 1. the cart is on the other side and 2. entering moldarach drops you in infinite loop i believe

TestRunner wrote

If you could get early ToT, you would go through the dungeon backwards, skipping the entire Lanaryu Desert Section. But again, this is all theoretical. First find a way into ToT, then we can talk about how it is sequence breaks. It is clear it would be worth it, but it's probably impossible with current known glitches.

We discussed this about 2 months ago.
It is not possible to skip all of lanayru desert, however, back then we had a lot of theories.
This was my route theory if we could get ToT early:
First get ToT early while being OoB to reach the OoB owl statue in ToT.
Wrong warp with that statue (not BiTWW just regular wrong warp)
This took you to the stone cache or w/e the building is called.
Continue all the way to the gust bellow.
Exit LMF and use the owl statue to get to ToT.
Enter and exit the back entrance to get the harp.

This didn't work since we couldn't find a way to access ToT in its OoB state.

My second theory was to just access the north section of the desert, enter LMF, get the gust bellows, exit.
Then take the north-west path to ToT and somehow get over the broken wall.
Then just enter and exit the back entrance to get the harp.

I have been very close to get up onto the broken wall at ToT, like a few pixels away, but it just wasn't enough.
If we could perform a highjump anywhere, I'm pretty sure we could get over.

The thing is that this only would save a few minutes now that we have the BiTWW in LMF. It is still a decent timesaver though.

Where do you next need gust bellows? Sand sea? That feels wrong.

You need Gust Bellow to turn the windmills in Skyloft to obtain the Harp. So pretty much right after LMF.

Oh yeah. Forgot bout those

What did you do to get yourself close to the wall?
On the right side of the wall, part of it sticks out(not the white part, the brown wall) near the right corner next to the TOT wall....so I was able to do a double run up.

In the 4th dungeon you used zombies to get a little higher. Would regular moblins work the same way? There are two moblins when you first get to this area and make it past.

Well, moblins could get some more height. If anything, the way we will get over will not be at the temple itself, but rather the cliffs around the whole area. Final strike, highflip, idk.

Well, haven't had a chance yet to find out of those areas are solid or not. Hope they are.
Hmm, how would final strike even give us more height for the TOT.

The only way I can think of is if we could push a moblin through a wall.

BTW, when I was in lake floria area. I saw this skull and pushed it straight enough that it went through the wall. I only managed to do this once, and the wall was slanted.
By slanted, I mean this. If you stood against the wall and did a moon jump, you would be pushed back as you went higher.

Well, i have tested the walls around the ToT area. They are solid on top for a long ways out. Still, I don't like talking about this, as it seems so out of reach and its been speculated about since the game first came out. And I believe you mean boboklin, as there are no moblins close to ToT. A boboklin could get height the same way as it does for the basement skip, by doing a final strike with a wall that juts out infront of you. I see no area that would work for this.

Pushing an object through a wall is much more different than pushing an enemy, as enemies are specifically programmed not to go through walls, where objects, as I would guess, are programmed to exist, but aren't worried too much about collisions.

I realize loading data from other files(even threw a glitch) is against the rules in a speedrun. But an exception was made for Oot 3ds. New game+. I was wondering if a similar category could be used in skyward sword useing BIT to load cutscenes from a different file.

Well, NG+ is already used. Starting a race in hero mode is technically NG+. But using other premade files will never be accepted in an official any%/harp run. Perhaps a fun race, but it would need to be a special category.

red hawk1001 wrote

I realize loading data from other files(even threw a glitch) is against the rules in a speedrun. But an exception was made for Oot 3ds. New game+. I was wondering if a similar category could be used in skyward sword useing BIT to load cutscenes from a different file.

Loading data from other files isn't against SDA's rules as long as they are created during the run.

For BiT, I can save at a bird statue then go into another area and die there right? For example, I save at a statue in an area with no monsters, go right into a different loading zone and die quickly there.

Most people use the corrupt "insta-death" save to activate BiT

I know that, but I tried to activate BiT in the waterfall cave, (killing link inside) and it did not work.

Some maps just won't work. I think I've got it in the waterfall cave, idk. I know it won't work in the boss trials and demise.

There are a bunch of areas that you can't die in to activate BiT. Some of these places include:

• Inside the Isle of Songs
• The Waterfall Cave
• Sequences
• Bosses

Mind you, you can save in one of these areas (ie the Isle of the Songs) and then go outside to kill yourself to activate BiT. Although mzx was right, in this situation you'd save then load your corrupt file.

So to sum it up, yes you can just go into another area to die.

When I was playing SS yesterday I did make this picture for skyview temple BITWW. I was thinking should we do this for all areas of the game and upload them to SS section of ZSR? That would be much more better in my oppinion than having table to tell where you warp. Same way with this you can also add explanation if that spot is usefull at all and tell if you can use it for something. Is this good idea or is it just waste of time? Numerical order is same as picture on the first page of this forum.

Here is picture what I did:
Original imageLoad image

Hrm, that sounds like a good idea actually. It would be a nice way to tell whether any of the OoB spots are close enough to the level to be almost useful... I never thought of checking the map when I used them <.< But yeah I'm all for it.

This sounds like a great idea. I would help contribute if my little bro didnt delete his file on the game (put over 200 hours into it just to delete it and start over, even though there was still a blank file -_-)